Proof Ascended Astarion really loves you

the title and caption are clearly ironic chill lmao

Astarion and Tav went through two very different processes of becoming a spawn - for him it was extremely painful and he had to dig his way out of his grave, for the player it's painless and they just wake up with new abilities. In some DnD books this second process (accompanied with giving a little blood) is described as creating a vampire bride. It's unclear how canon that is in BG3 I think it's still save to say Tav is not a regular spawn

Astarion: "you already perfect, it's hard to improve" Me: "take notes to seduce women"

I played as a Durge who is just as obsessed with Astarion as he is with her. She craves power but rejected Bhaal only because she knew he would make her kill Astarion eventually. So she ascends Astarion to create their own evil legacy together.

I feel like ascended Astarion had some writer clash going on because this tone is different from his other lines. When you confront the brain it still calls spawn Astarion "the rat catcher that became a lord" (the line in the game script appears twice, so spawn was supposed to get a different one but it didn't get finished on time). Makes me wonder what they were cooking with the upper city but couldn't finish it.

Also if you read DnD bestiaries on vampires like monsters of the multiverse, vampires actually lose the ability to "love" and it's replaced with obsession instead –and more in a vanity/perfection-in-youth sense (the core books specifically used children as an example of an object of obsession...). So all things considered, ascended Astarion's way of showing love is actually not that bad. It's not that good either, but for a vampire it's pretty stellar lmao

Ascended is so fascinating, in a bit of a train wreck kind of way because, really, at what point is he lying to the PC, at what point is he lying to himself, or just masking? I've seen some comments on these videos state that what he describes is not the process for making a regular spawn, but a vampire bride/groom, which creates a very different creature to a spawn. To summarise what I've seen other commenters share: The method is different (instead of just draining, there's three bites, draining, and a drop of blood before the bride/groom dies, so they change before death, not after, going from alive to undead, not alive to dead to undead), and the end result is still very much the same person as when they were alive (unchanged, as he said), shares in the power of the vampire that created them (which since the PC doesn't burn up at the end as spawn-Astarion does, is actually happening), and while bound to the vampire is not fully controlled by them (though they can mutually agree to divorce to break that bond - not likely to happen even if the relationship goes bad given vampire possessiveness and obsession). The biggest down side is the bride/groom, still being of the same mind as when they were alive, doesn't have vampire instincts, no hunger or innate understanding of their needs, so the vampire needs to teach them, which if the vamp messes that up can cause their bride/groom to go mad. So, Ascended Astarion doesn't spell it out (despite calling the PC his consort, which is easily dismissed as flowery flattery), likely due to fear and insecurity and a big ol' dose of Vampiric corruption and twisting of emotions, but in vamp terms he really does flat out marry the PC, right there, before the final fight, the PC really does become his consort, his vampiric spouse. He does care, does love in an extremely possessive, twisted kind of way, that can and does turn flat out abusive if the PC gets buyers regret for the dark situation they've landed themselves in, but it is a kind of love, vampire style.

It’s mad how different ascended Astarion acts depending on what dialog options you choose. I’ve seen him be sweet and loving still to straight up evil. This version is a lot more complex than the spawn version and makes me want to try and do a “healthy” vs toxic ascended Astarion to see the differences in its full extent.

I mean, you can bite him every day to have the happy buff so technically, you feed on him and eventually, at some point, you'll become a full vampire.

I just think there should be more choices to hug him in the game as there are a few times dialogue should have given the option to hug him for comfort 😢❤️

He doesn’t seem genuinely happy, like he’s just trying to convince himself that he is because he can’t go back now

It’s interesting to see people arguing over “no he’s toxic and it’s a bad relationship” and “no he loves Tav” Those things aren’t mutually exclusive. They can BOTH be true and even at the same time as eachother. People who engage in toxic or abusive behaviour are capable of love, they just aren’t necessarily capable of creating or maintaining healthy relationships because of their toxic choices and personality

During the long rest after he ascends before he makes you a vampire if you succeed the insight check you can see what he really thinks of you. He may love you but will never consider you an equal. It makes me think of how in Invincible Omniman still loves his wife but more like a pet than a person.

i think people view ascended astarion’s route way too black and white. it’s not as simple as “astarion doesn’t love tav anymore”. his love has just become twisted and tainted and i love the tragedy of that. yes he’s controlling and a lot more possessive and it’s obviously not a healthy love but he still loves tav in the only way he knows how after what he’s become. i think a part of spawn astarion is still in there based on some moments where his vulnerability slips through but that part of him is locked very deep inside and the facade he wore in the beginning that was slowly becoming undone, has become nearly hard as steel to penetrate because he never truly got to heal and i find that far more compelling than “he’s pure evil now and incapable of love and feelings” but hey that’s just my interpretation

Also note with the vampire bride theory is one of Ascended Astarion’s lines is him loving the idea of Bhaal’s army of you play as Durge, saying it would be a lovely dowry like WHERES THE DOWRY COMING FROM IF NOT FROM A MARRIAGE

Except if you have Tav ask Astarion if he'll take control of them, which is an option I believe later in the dialogue tree, he'll say "Of course not, you're going to be wonderfully obedient." Tav has a dialogue option to ask when they'll become a TRUE vampire, and Astarion reassures them it'll happen "in due time," so even if people misinterpret his explanation, he didn't make Tav a full vampire. Tav is his spawn. Like, yeah, Astarion loves Tav, but Ascended Astarion loves Tav in a way a person loves a possession. If Tav refuses to become his spawn if he's Ascended, they break up. He will only have a Tav that will submit because them becoming his spawn is the only way he can feel secure that they won't and can't betray him.

As much as I prefer spawn Astarion route, I'm definitely trying this one at least once. I even have a character in mind to do so (my OC from different game lol) I feel like Ascended Astarion is pretty horrible at times, but I like this outcome because of story reasons. I'm not teady yet to try to romance him in this state, but maybe... My OC character actually would do both, keep him as a spawn and ket him do the ritual - for simply having someone to love. My deranged self-righteous high elf mage would be good match for him lol this or evil durge to try out obviously. I don't hate Ascended Astarion, but as for my own romance I prefer other route, it feel a bit more for me. Or maybe I just want to be the stronger one at least once and protect him (in some sense). I kove how complex his character is and both outcomes make perfect sense for me, even if one almost breaks my heart I'm starting to see why so many people defend it. I might not agree with all that pure love confessions from Ascended Astarion, but I want to see it for myself, not just bits of opinions of other people. My biggest problem with this would be that... I want to be dominant myself or at least have option to switch parts 😂 I'm bot submissive overall, but maybe I will be able to create character who would be more willing just for fun of it (If I won't die cringing, I hope not, I like Astarion too much 😂) Somehow seeing both sides helps me understand that .. people are crazy af for being this hateful towards others 💀 Sorry for a bit dramatic puke of words, very good video btw 👍 I got information I wanted to see.

This game is truly a dissertation on how absolute power corrupts absolutely

I thought that Ascended Astarion was pure evil, but seen this, maybe my chaotic good warlock will try a healthy ascended Astarion romance, while my goody two-shoes cleric will just love healthy unascended Astarion.

Step 1: idealization Step 2: breaching boundaries Step 3: reward/punishment Step 4: devaluation Step 5: conflict Step 6: discard Step 7: reinforcing a state of dependence Rinse and repeat..